Self-Steering Options

danagle · 2009-03-09 06:18:02

I'm in the market for self-steering. I'd like to add this because most of my sailing is single-handed and the trips last for 8-10 hours. It would be nice to be able to continue sailing when I need to use the head, rather than heave to like I do now. (Getting food, reading a book, and fishing would be nice to do also).

Does anyone have recommendations for a Mk I? I'm open to anything, and in fact I would consider having redundant systems since there may come a time in the year or two where I'll be making much longer passages (weeks at a time) and self-steering might be critical.

Dan A.
s/v Juno

pura vida · 2009-03-09 08:03:33

Have you considered an autohelm tiller pilot? Also Marcus on Midnight Flyer reported good results with his windvane a few years ago.
Mike M
SV Wind Horse
#375
Galveston, Tx

windyday · 2009-03-09 20:44:57

Depends on use: weekend daytripping versus cruising. There are several good choices now for electric self-steering systems for boats our size. Electrcial automatic steering is convenient and fairly easy to set up, just watch the electrical budget carefully. They can drain batteries if they work hard. Great for taking short breaks during a long day sail though, and on a small sailboat with limited battery weight, that's a good use of them.

Our boat has an old Autohelm on a pedestal wheel. I haven't used it myself yet on this boat, (still refitting), but it is fused for 15 amps, and I expect it draws 1-5 or more amps in use, probably averaging 3-4 amps, transiently jumping when stressed, but that's just wild guessing, based on googling. Our boat had two group 24 batteries, and I am dedicating one to house, which will supply the Autohelm. At 4 amps, I can't expect more than a few hours of draw from a steadily working autohelm with close attention to sail trim to reduce its workload, even using batteries with dual engine start/deep cycle capability. The battery shelves might support Group 27 batteries, but they are heavier and don't add a lot more reserve time at that amperage. I don't want to use a pair Trojan 6 volt batteries for the house bank because I want to keep things simple for my type of sailing, I want two batteries the same, and I want to minimize battery weight and space. I could use a pair of deep cycle 12 volt batteries, one for engine and one for house, because the Atomic 4 does not need much current to start, but they tend to be larger and heavier than standard Canadian Tire Nautilus group 24 or 27 batteries.

So, I can't expect to sail day and night on the Autohelm, only running the engine a couple of times of day for an hour. Instead, I'll have to expect to hand steer most of the time, reserving the Autohelm for short periods to rest, trim sails, check navigation, get lunch and visit the head.

---------
"New" 1974 C&C 27 Mk II undergoing refit

Last edited by (2009-03-11 08:37:39)

danagle · 2009-03-09 23:31:22

Hmm. Good points. I hadn't even thought of the power budget yet. Solar panels are on my "to do" list, but are closer to the bottom.

I few months ago I was looking at wind vanes. The prices are 2-3 times what the electronic systems. It might be worth just splurging on this since a) I'll need one down the road anyway, and b) saves me from having to get solar panels and re-arrange my electrical system now.

I did a search to find Midnight Flyer's results but nothing came up. I'm interested to find out what Marcus purchased. I am considering using <a href="http://www.windpilot.com/en/Ra/raproen.html" target="_new">WindPilot Pacific Light</a> which is relatively inexpensive (~$2,500) and had decent feedback and a couple of sites.

David Masury · 2009-03-10 20:51:08

I would suggest an Autohelm... you sometimes can find used units that people don't use anymore ...ebay or craigslist. The C&C 27 has a fairly light helm so power consumption is lower than other boats... the newer units will tie into your GPS unit for added control.
'IRIS'
1975 C&C 27 Mk lll
Hull # 453
Kittery Point, Maine

pura vida · 2009-03-11 08:16:09

First apologies to Marco on Midnight Flyer. I recalled his name off the top of my head and should have refreshed my memory.
I keep a group 24 (starting) and a group 27 (house) on my boat and have never ran out of power. I use a 6 watt Sieman’s panel to keep the batteries fresh and it does too good of a job because, if I am not careful, it cooks them despite the charge controller.
Almost two years ago I quit working with the intent of going sailing in the Bahamas or going back to school. School won. But I had done some of this same research. For a time I considered putting a below deck autopilot that I could steer with a remote control. Price killed that plan, but I still think it was a good one under the right circumstances. One thing to consider when calculating your energy budget with either solar or wind or both it the weight aloft. The 27 is a really light boat and having two big solar panels on the bimini and a wind generator might really change the way she handles. I ended up keeping my 6 watt and bought a Honda EU1000 generator which is tiny, quiet and will run my AC if needed. One last thought is that the MKI is a little heavier on the helm than the later boats. I have overwhelmed my Autohelm 800, but the wind was gusting to about 30 knots and I had too much sail up. One real benefit to the Autohelm idea is redundancy. When I replace my 800 with a new 1000 I’m going to keep it as a spare.
All the best....
Here are some emails that Marco and I exchanged:
Marco’s text below...
Wow! The Bahama's! You are making me crazy...
Anyway, I have a windvane from Windpilot (<a href="http://www.windpilot.com/">http://www.windpilot.com/</a>) and my experiences are very good, except for moderate winds from the back ... It works, but you need to tweak it more often. But in general my experiences are very good!
The owners of Windpilot.com are very nice and experienced and can help you out with all your questions. They even wrote a free book about windvanes (not just their brand, but a general book). It should be downloadable from their website, otherwise I can get you a copy.
On Tue, 29 Nov 2005, Mike M wrote:
> I'm guessing the you have the "Pacific" on Midnight Flyer.
Yep, that's right. Although I think the Pacific Light would also work for me. But we'd better be on the safe side, huh? :-)
Cheers,
Marco

Mike M
SV Wind Horse
#375
Galveston, Tx

danagle · 2009-03-28 23:42:42

Wow, I just saw your reply. Not sure why I didn't notice it before now. Some really great information here... thank you very much.

I've decided to put the self-steering on the back burner for the moment (2-3 more months) and purchase a roller furling system first. The unit I'm getting is the Harken Unit 0 Mk4. I have to wait 3 weeks before getting it because the new genoa is being made.

If anyone has any negative input on the Harken Unit 0 I'd love to hear it before I install this baby. I can still change the model, if needed.

pura vida · 2009-03-29 02:33:08

You are welcome. Good idea, going with the roller furling first. One is on my short list. Of course a good autopilot goes a long way to making solo headsail changes easier. Raytheon may not like the idea, but often I end up using the tried and true 'Bungie Pilot' ala Larry Pardee. I have to be going the same direction for a long time before I mess with the AP.

You may want to start a new thread on the roller furling just in case someone in the know is not following this one. I'm not familiar with that particular unit, but I've always had good results with Harken equipment.

regards
Mike M
SV Wind Horse
#375
Galveston, Tx

C&C 27 Association Forum

Announcement

#1 2009-03-09 06:18:02

Self-Steering Options

#2 2009-03-09 08:03:33

Re: Self-Steering Options

#3 2009-03-09 20:44:57

Re: Self-Steering Options

#4 2009-03-09 23:31:22

Re: Self-Steering Options

#5 2009-03-10 20:51:08

Re: Self-Steering Options

#6 2009-03-11 08:16:09

Re: Self-Steering Options

#7 2009-03-28 23:42:42

Re: Self-Steering Options

#8 2009-03-29 02:33:08

Re: Self-Steering Options

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