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I'm about to make an offer on a mark V but 12 - 15' cracks in the gel coat around the windows are making me hesitate. Last year the owner had the windows professionally resealed with some hi tech epoxy. I'm worried since the windows in a mark V are structural that there may be a serious problem with fiberglass failure around the cabin. The broker gets really vague when I ask for details and I haven't found a west coast surveyor who has any experience with the Mark 5.
Has anyone encountered this before?
Anyone have any ideas?
Thanks
This is a tough question, because the boat could have been seriously damaged somehow (in a way that may or not be fixable, but could be a financial negotiating point if fixable) or it could be suffering from clumsily applied gelcoat that is causing (and will continue to cause) cosmetic problems.
Are you hesitating before putting in an offer or are you hesitating before paying for a survey? If this is the only vexing problem you can see and otherwise you like the boat, go for the survey (and read the Black Arts article on buying before you choose a surveyor - in my opinion it's better to get a sharp surveyor than a surveyor who's familiar with the Mark V). But don't move without a survey - these cracks sound huge.
David Weatherston
Towser, Toronto
C&C 27 Mk IV
David Weatherston
Towser, Toronto
C&C 27 Mk IV
Offline
My MKV has small 1 to 3" long cracks radiating from the corners of the windows. The gelcoat is really thick in that area, and the cracks don't worry me. I have much longer cracks - 3 or 4 feet long - at all of the "corners" - where the cockpit floor meets the side bulkheads, at the corners in the stern, where the cabin meets the deck, etc. Those cracks don't worry me much (well, maybe a little bit) since they are mostly where the boat is solid glass.
In any case, a surveyor should be able to advise you, even if he has never seen a MKV - since all the other 25 year old boats I see have similar problems.
ALL MKV windows leak. Find out who resealed the windows and give him a call. If you trust the guy, good. If he's a hack, you end up doing the windows again.
Jim
Distant Thunder
Hull 69
Jim not all Mark V windows leak, the ones on Still Knot Working (ex Heatweave) don't leak, thanks to the job the previous owner had done. He had Bristol Marine remove the original windows, make new lexan ones and then had aluminum frames fabricated that thru-bolt through the cabin top with studs welded to the frames, the aliuminum was then painted to match the gelcoat and the finished product is windows that don't leak.
I to have some small hairlaine cracks radiating our from the corners of the windows, mostly from the upper forward corner on both sides, I don't worry about them much as they are in an area of soild glass and therefore not a major source of water migration.
Regards
Steve
Still Knot Working, Mark V #75
[Heatwave's owner supplied photos and text with which we covered this effective, if expensive, approach to fixing windows in Black Arts. A new, more accessible DIY method is now available but as our first use of this material is only half a season old, we can't offer an unreserved recommendation yet. - Admin]
Last edited by (2006-08-09 10:20:26)
It's not just the cost of survey.
I walked away from a boat this spring after a surveyor found a major/expensive flaw that I had missed. The surveyor had experience with the brand and model and knew just were to look.
It was a subtle problem and was probably not fixable.
Because the Mark V mast is stepped on deck I would expect the cabin would have to handle a lot of stress. Since the windows are structural I am worried the previous owner may have caused expensive structural damage by sailing with the windows poorly sealed or just tacked in with silicone.
I just want to do more research before going to the trouble of a survey again.
Thanks group for all the help.
[If you do succeed in finding reliable information on the structural implications of badly bonded windows, we'd be very grateful for an update. - Admin]
Last edited by (2006-08-10 05:08:36)
I had my windows preplaced on my MKV and the were screwed in, and caulked with an expensive adhesive. Things wored fine until the winter when the cold caused the window to shrink much more than the fibreglass. As a result one window cracked.
I have read that the fibreglass and the window material can differ substantially in the amount they shrink when it gets cold. If the material used to seal the window in place, was not flexible, it could be the difference in the shinking and expansion which caused the cracking. Although I am not sure.
Regards
Cameron
[The DIY Boat Owner magazine article referred to in the Windows entry in Black Arts devotes some discussion to the use of screws, the solution adopted by the majority of owners. Cameron is right about the difference in expansion of the two materials but the DIY author also stresses that plexiglass expands and contracts to an outrageous degree. It is important, he says, to drill screw holes more oversize than you'd think, plus you should use truss- or pan-head screws rather than flat-head screws, as the counter-sunk screw has a wedge effect that promotes cracking. - Admin]
Last edited by (2006-08-14 02:08:37)