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Fuel tanks often rust from the inside. A low cost solution, if the tank is not too badly corroded, is to remove it, clean it , and plastic coat the inside.
Products required, both USA produced, are Marine Clean and POR 15. The latter puts a complete coating on the inside of the tank, impervious to fuels, and will fill pinholes.Supplier:- POR 15 Inc, Restomotive Labs, Morristown, NJ.
I have used this to sucessfully repair a leaking tank on my 1956 MGA. (car not boat)
Frank Marsden
Steven,
I think that trying to straighten the rudder stock would be not only extremely difficult, but could possibly be potentially dangerous as there would be work hardening of the stainless steel, and maybe , hidden damage.
Before trying I would consult a metallurgist.
Ralph Ainslie, who has a storm damaged rudder, sent me photographs of the internal rudder structure; it maybe quicker, cheaper and easier to split the rudder vertically, and fit a whole new tube, then rebond the skins together.
I can only assume that the original production method was to lay up two rudder halves, mount on the stock, and then foam fill.
Maybe someone could confirm.
Frank Marsden
There are now pictures of a slab reefing setup on:-
<A href="http://w1.660.telia.com/~u66006007/trapper/">http://w1.660.telia.com/~u66006007/trapper/</A>
Frank Marsden
David,
Thank you.
I have always found that the friction on the clew slide is a major problem.
Is your main loose footed?
Frank
Absolutely agree, lead everthing back to the cockpit, however, I have never been able to get a mainsail clew outhaul to work on any boat I have owned, including dinghies. There always seems to be too much friction in the system
Frank Marsden
I would assume that the prop is offset to portspecifically to counteract the tendency to swing to port.
Frank Marsden
I would assume that the prop is offset to portspecifically to counteract the tendency to swing to port.
Frank Marsden
My other reason for needing a boom vang is to aid stability downwind.
I tried very hard to lead the controls back with a minimum of new holes, and in paticular no holes through the internal moulded headlining.
The coachroof design allows lines to be led back from the base of the mast to rope clutches immediately in front of the coachroof mounted winches without the need for organisers.
Frank Marsden
I have a Trapper 500, which, for this issue, is a MK I
The handling of the boat under sail and power is excellent.
The loads on the tiller are quite high, but not excessive.
I find the tiller marginally too long.
However, the problem I have is that the rudder, like a shopping trolley, has a mind of it's own. It is not possible to let go of the tiller for a second or two without the boat going off course. This is dramatic under power.
I initially thought that this was due to too much hydrodynamic balance. and that the solution would be to fit a MK III rudder; I am now not so sure.
I am thinking that the rudder behavior, on my boat, is caused by it's proximity to a large fixed three blade prop, which has insufficient tip clearance, and that this is causing the rudder to move, not only under power, but also when sailing. My previous boat was a Hustler 25.5, of similar lines to the 27, but with a small two blade prop much further away from the transom mounted rudder. This had similar weather helm, but would go much further before rounding up into wind.
The boat would be improved by a MK III rudder, but would the characterisic still be present?
Actions?
1/ Fit a Tiller Tamer. (Davis)
2/ Fit a two blade folding prop.(Gori or Flex-o-Fold)
3/ Add a tiller pilot, (Simrad TP 10)
Only then contemplate a new rudder, MK III or similar.
Frank Marsden
Ralph
Email <A href="mailto:fdmarsden@aol.com">fdmarsden@aol.com</A>
Frank
Ralph,
Can you, please, give the internal construction details, of the rudder, as I would like to make a MK III one.
Frank Marsden
Charles,
I have a Trapper 500, which is almost a C&C 27 MK I. This has single line slab reefing, roller furling genoa and all lines led back to the cockpit; this latter is a very simple modification.
To me, sailing without a kicking strap (British English for vang) is quite unthinkable.
Would you like me to email you photos of the setup?
Frank Marsden
"Chanterelle" GBR 3408Y
David,
I had a look at Flex-o-fold at the Southampton boat show, and was less than impressed with the amount of backlash in the gears on the blades. I had the impression that they were cast, rather than machined. The prices of the two are about the same.
I mention the tip clearance as the boat seems to have a much stronger prop-walk than I have previously experienced. It does not have much vibration.
I have Turbocad V9, which can output in Autocad format and jpeg. The jpeg files are quite small. When imported into MS Word, the file size is acceptable.
Frank
David,
I also, would appreciate a drawing.
Do you think that you could send it to put on the "Trapper Improvement Page?
<A href="http://w1.660.telia.com/~u66006007/trapper/">http://w1.660.telia.com/~u66006007/trapper/</A>
Or, if your drawing is only a sketch, I could put it in Autocad format, and jpeg
I am investigating a folding prop. Gori come up with a size of 14" x 9 1/2", and 1.4" tip clearance. I have only 0.5" tip clearance.
I wonder if this is exacerbating the effects of wash on the rudder.
Frank Marsden
Divided by a common language.
What is a "fraculator"
Frank Marsden
Trapper 500 "Chanterelle"
David,
Thank you for the suggestion.
Overnight, I decided that the thing to do would be to make a strap about 8" long with two bolt holes, the upper one to fit the lower existing bolt, placed underneath the existing chainplate, replacing the wood in that area. The backing plate on the foreside of the bulkhead would be replaced by a longer three hole one.
The reason to do it this way is to make it easier to get the holes accurate, by avoiding bending the additional strap
This would end up looking very like your modified photo, and hopefully would look like it was done that way originally.
Frank
David,
Sending you email with picture of the port chainplate which has small signs of damage, the starboard one is ok, all components are stainless
I think that the bulkhead is in good condition (1978 boat)
I suggest adding a further strip of stainless (316) directly to the bulkhead with no spacer, and replace the backing plate on the other side of the bulkhead with a longer one.
Laser cutting is accurate to about one thou, i.e. better then drilling, but due to the slightly serrated edge not as good as reamed.
The advantace of laser is that I can draw it in Cad, and send it to the cutting company attached to an email, in DXF format, and they cut directly from that.
Frank
In the UK there seem to be a few Trapper 500's which have some trouble with the chainplates for the shrouds, i.e. some delamination of the bulkhead, and signs of small upward movement of the plates, evidenced by the bolts no longer being horizontal.
Is there a proven fix? With today's technology getting s/s plate laser cut accuately to any design is remarkably easy and economical.
Frank Marsden
There is now a scanned version of the Trapper 500 1970's manual on the Trapper improvement website, much of this will be similar to C&C 27 mks I , II & III
<A href="http://w1.660.telia.com/~u66006007/trapper/">http://w1.660.telia.com/~u66006007/trapper/</A>
Frank Marsden
Chuck,
I have made a strut from an unseviceable tiller pilot to hold the rudder ahead, but that has the disadvantage that I cannot access the starboard cockpit locker at the very time you need to.
Thank you for the realisation that a strop to port is all that is needed, I will adopt your idea, if I may.
Does your boat have the scimitar rudder?
Mine is a Trapper 500, which I have had on the water for five weeks, and the more I sail it the more I like it.
The boat is enduringly popular in the UK, universally praised, and has sailed the Triangle race, which goes from Torquay to Ireland, Brittany and back.
Frank Marsden
Is a gz curve available for the 27?
Or, the value of the AVS?
Frank Marsden
Neil
Is a drawing of the high aspect ratio rudder available?
I think that I should replace the scimitar rudder on my boat.
Frank
Neil.
Which rudder do you have?
Frank
Yes, please.
My preference would be to fit/make a 501 rudder, if that solves the issue.
However, if it does not, and there is a further improvement to make, then a non-standard design is ok.
I infer that there are some C&C 27's (Canadian built) in the UK. Must predate the RCD
Frank
David,
Today, I found in Ian Nicolson's "boat data book" 4th edition page 194 " a balanced rudder normally has 1/6th of the area ahead of the centreline of the stock. More than that can be dangerous"
From the views of the 27 it seems to me that the total balance area is about 1/12th . however, the area in the prop wash is about 1/5th
This would tie in with good sailing handling, but less than good undaer power.
Further winter project. new rudder. (adding to all the others)
Frank